They were my lifeline alone at sea | Vicky Anstey

Vicki Anstey  00:00

And I ended up taking 70 letters.

Holly Newson  00:02

70?!

Vicki Anstey  00:04

So not from 70 different people, you know, lots of people wrote me multiple letters.

Holly Newson  00:08

How much of your like supplies was that?

Holly Newson  00:15

Hey, I'm Holly, and I am so glad you're here. This is Kind, a show about the times people received an act of kindness and how that changed things. In this episode, you'll hear how a row across an ocean is made to feel possible by some friends all the way back in the UK. By the way, you're a ray of sunshine. Right, let me introduce you to someone. You're about to hear from Vicky Anstey, a speaker, coach, entrepreneur, and adventurer who was one of the first women to reach the final stages of SAS Who Dares Wins and has broken world records rowing the mid-Pacific and cycling across America. She's now an author too of her book, Other People Are Like the Weather. Vicky, welcome!

Vicki Anstey  01:05

Thank you for having me. It's so lovely to be here.

Holly Newson  01:08

I am so thrilled to have you on the show. So, my first question to you is: What does being kind mean to you? What do you think it means?

Vicki Anstey  01:16

Oh gosh, that's such a hard question to answer.

Holly Newson  01:21

We like to go and go in hot, yeah.

Vicki Anstey  01:24

Oh, I think it can be lots of things. For me, probably the biggest gesture of kindness that any of us can offer another person is to hold space, and yeah, I've had lots of wonderful examples of that over the years, through all the different ups and downs of my life, where you know, particularly friends have quietly held space for me. You know, not judging my decisions or choices or outcomes of of certain scenarios, but just instead watching with care and love, and and then being there to, you know, handle the fallout. I suppose, or yeah, just that I think kindness isn't necessarily about big gestures. It's it's it is the small stuff, and sometimes the really quiet or silent moments that matter the most,

Holly Newson  02:23

And that holding space, what does that look like? Is that like listening, or is there something else to it?

Vicki Anstey  02:29

I think I am lucky enough to have some really, really tight friends, girlfriends in my life, and it's going to make me a bit emotional already. You know, one of them yesterday. You know, she knows that this is a a kind of high octane phase of my life. I'm about to launch my first book, and and you know, some of us we have each other on Find My Friends. And I spoke to her last night, and she said, "Yeah, I saw you were in Soho yesterday, and then you were somewhere else, and then you know, and I, I, I had completely forgotten that I was on her Find My Friends. That she, you know, didn't occur to me that she would be kind of watching over me in a in a you know really caring way, and being invested in what I was doing, in spite of her busy day. So yeah, I think it's just it is that sense of knowing if you're lucky enough to have those really really good friends that they are watching out for you.

Holly Newson  03:33

Yeah,

Vicki Anstey  03:34

yeah, not trying to manage anything for you, but just yeah, lovingly

Holly Newson  03:40

yeah

Vicki Anstey  03:40

watching.

Holly Newson  03:41

They're there.

Vicki Anstey  03:42

Yeah,

Holly Newson  03:42

yeah,

Vicki Anstey  03:43

yeah, and it matters deeply.

Holly Newson  03:46

And so each time someone comes on this show, I ask them to have a think about three times people have done something kind for them. And yours will give us some little teasers of your book too, which is great. So for this first one, will you explain what was going on in your life at the time.

Vicki Anstey  04:04

Yeah, so the first example was around the time where I had finally plucked up the courage to leave my marriage. So I'd been in a relationship from the age of 19 to 39 – 20 years, a really long chunk of anyone's life, and it had been a relationship that had gone through stages and phases, and you know hadn't always been limiting, but had certainly become that way for me. And you know, I I'd kind of got myself to a point in my life, where I just didn't recognize who I was anymore, and you know, I I'd sort of handed over financial agency to my ex husband, and I, you know, I was really sort of questioning everything about myself. I was, you know, previously a very capable, confident, accomplished, successful woman. You know, I started out my professional career in advertising, and I'd done extremely well in that industry. And then I'd had a complete pivot into the fitness industry and set up the first bar studio in the UK. I suppose on the outside I looked like I was ticking all the boxes and thriving, but my internal reality was was quite different, and I and I think I had just realized that I had yeah lost my sense of self, and that the relationship wasn't what it had been, but I did eventually find the courage to to leave, and I didn't have a bank account of my own, which I also carried a lot of shame for. Yeah, you know, at the age of 40,

Holly Newson  05:55

Feels like something you should have done, but like in in this kind of world of 'shoulds' that that you know don't actually mean anything, but you know it's still there in our brains nonetheless.

Vicki Anstey  06:05

Yeah, absolutely, and you know we we go along with all sorts of things in our lives that we think are okay or normal or you know more efficient or practical. Yeah, and you know I was yeah, I was turning 40, and I had to regain control of my personal finances, my business, which my ex husband had also run. You know, I kind of really just become the face of it, and I had a lot to learn, and you know, not least obviously navigating suddenly being on my own for the first time in 20 years, and then yeah, that kind of incredibly steep learning curve of of getting back into the driving seat of my life, and so it was a very stressful period. And one of my friends, Ali, who has been a constant in my life for a really long time now, was with me one particular afternoon. We were training together actually outside and and we both, for some reason, happened to glance at my phone, which was on a park bench, and it flashed up with a notification from my bank account to tell me I had six pounds balance left in my account, which a pretty devastating moment, and probably one that I've obviously I'm sharing this with the world now, but at the time, you know, the only the the kind of thing you only really want to share with your best friends, and what she did next was just quite remarkable. I mean, obviously, you know, the knowing glances and the hugs, but you know, we said we sort of said our goodbyes, and I went home, and I thought she had too. And then about half an hour, 45 minutes later, she arrived at my house with three huge bags of Waitrose shopping to keep me going, And you know that will stay with me forever. I think, yeah, such a simple thing,

Holly Newson  08:31

But such what you you needed, just to be taken care of in that simple way.

Vicki Anstey  08:38

Yeah, and nourished, and you know, and obviously, you know, she'd Ali, being Ali, had carefully selected every item that went into those bags. You know, but it was just the the selflessness behind it, and just such a a quiet gesture. You know,

Holly Newson  08:59

Yeah. Do you remember any particular thing that she bought that you were like, Ali of course you bought that!

Vicki Anstey  09:06

Oh God. Well, yeah. I mean, she's very, very healthy. So lots of cream veggies and things like that. I think there were, I think there were a few chocolate bars snuck in there as well. So yeah, it's just, but just such a lovely and just so typical of her, you know. I don't actually think we even really said anything to each other. She just helped me unpack it into my fridge, and then, you know, she was off. But yeah, things like that. I think that's the epitome of kindness. Actually, it's like really understanding what someone needs in a moment,

Holly Newson  09:44

and what impact did that gesture have on you?

Vicki Anstey  09:51

Well, I think in a funny way, it was probably the first time that I accepted kindness or accepted help. And you know, particularly in the aftermath of leaving my marriage and going through this divorce, I think I'd sort of started to become quite hyper independent, and you know, kind of shutting things down. You know, a sort of, I suppose, defense mechanism, perhaps putting on my armor, being ready to go to war, and yeah, she she really helped me to help myself. You know, allow me to ask other people to help, and and that's such a great lesson because people want to help us more than we think.

Holly Newson  10:40

Yeah,

Vicki Anstey  10:41

yeah. We just have to, we just have to let them sometimes. That it really mattered.

Holly Newson  10:48

Will you describe Ali to me? What like what is what does she look like and what does she like?

Vicki Anstey  10:54

Ali is, so Ali's about 20 years older than me.

Holly Newson  10:58

Okay,

Vicki Anstey  10:58

yeah, and so we've been friends for, gosh, probably about 15 years, maybe longer now, and we met each other through fitness. And she's very active and has always been. And she is just the warmest, kindest, but wisest human that I know, and so vulnerable. And she's a real fighter. She's had her own challenges in her life, and she's never afraid to stand up for others and to call out bad behaviors at times, and I so admire that about her. We do have that in common for sure. We're both, you know, when it comes to elephants in the room, we're we're the ones pointing percent, and you know that can get you into all sorts of tricky situations. But I just admire her integrity so so much, and she inspires me to, you know, live such an overused word, but as as authentically as I can as well, you know. And it's quite nice to feel like you've got someone, you know, alongside who also upholds those principles.

Holly Newson  12:19

This is a bit of a tangent, but are you the sort of person where if you read a book and a character is like you know when they're not saying something and you know that's part of the narrative, are you like screaming in your head like just... just?!

Vicki Anstey  12:29

Yeah, yeah and you know and also for my own book part of the the the need to write it was about daring to to to speak my truth, yeah, and um, and probably the hardest thing that I've done, all of the endeavors that I've taken on, you know, included, it so hard takes so much courage to do that. But if I can show others that you know we all struggle at times, and we all go through adversity by speaking openly about it and writing openly about it. Then, yeah, that's been it's been a hard decision for me to make with the book, but I needed it to be honest.

Holly Newson  13:17

Can you tell me a time that someone did something kind for you could be big, small, anything that comes to mind.

Jamie  13:23

So my son was in intensive care in Evelina Children's Hospital recently for a few weeks, and basically all the all the team there were like really kind to him in the way that they looked after him and the way they cared with it for him and the way they spoke to him even when he wasn't like very awake because of his like condition at the time. So yeah, I guess just the way that those nurses and all the doctors, all the staff there, were just really kind to him and also supported us as like his his parents. So yeah, that's the first thing that comes to mind when you ask me that. Nurses, nurses are doctors.

Holly Newson  13:59

That's such a brilliant answer. How is your son doing now?

Jamie  14:03

Yeah, he's he's doing he's doing a lot better now. He he's out of hospital and he's he's back in nursery. So yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Holly Newson  14:09

Amazing. And what's your name?

Jamie  14:10

My name's Jamie.

Holly Newson  14:11

Jamie. Thank you so much. Such pleasure to meet you. I'll leave you to eat your lunch.

Jamie  14:14

Thank you.

Holly Newson  14:19

So moving on to the second act of kindness. Will you start by introducing us to Erica?

Vicki Anstey  14:26

Yeah. So Erica is someone that I came across while I was running my barre studio while I was still married, and as I mentioned previously, you know my husband really ran all of the kind of operational financial side of the business, and there were times where I found that uncomfortable. You know, that there's a sort of really long period of time where this kind of creeping realization that I wasn't really living my life in the. That I needed to came about, and as part of that, I started to sort of push back and think about having a mentor, business mentor, because really, up until that point, everything was between the two of us, and I felt that I was asking for permission to do anything differently or to I don't know I mean literally from anything kind of studio repairs to investing money to grow the business and and everything was sort of within our marriage and in this quite increasingly difficult limiting dynamic and he was quite resistant to it but in spite of that, I I do have a bit of a rebellious streak for sure, and I kind of couldn't let go of the idea. So, and I happened to come across this woman, Erica, on Instagram. So I reached out to her, and we had a meeting, and her and I became great friends and allies. And she started to ask difficult questions of me. I suppose maybe things that she had observed in that business and personal dynamic that she felt as a very strong woman herself. That I suppose I should reclaim for myself. So she really held a mirror up to me on several occasions. She was, you know, pretty tough at times, which I valued hugely. Yeah, I think there were moments where I found it quite confronting. But you know, in hindsight, just there's so much value attached to that. Yeah, she wanted me to kind of step up and and rise up to get back in in control, really. So she was there through the dismantling of that marriage, and you know me ultimately disengaging from the business arrangement as well, and and taking my business forward.

Holly Newson  17:04

Yeah. So, what did it look like when you got, you know, you actually got oversight of the business and the financial side and how it was running? What what was that looking like?

Vicki Anstey  17:14

Yeah, it was a mess, and I had no idea of that. And you know, to this day, it feels naive that that should be the case, and perhaps to some extent it was. You know, there may have been an element for me where it was convenient that he would run all of that, you know, that side of the business. But he also ran it in a in a way that seemed overly complex, and it wasn't until you know I worked with Erica that I understood that it could be run in a very different way. So yeah, she really helped me piece by piece to kind of peel away those layers of of complexity and understand you know what my PNL was and you know what costs and overheads I had to account for, and you know what strategically we might need to do with the business to drive sales initially to kind of get it back on its feet and and to to cover some of the the debt that the business was carrying that I didn't also know about. Yeah, but there was one particular moment, and and in reference to your questions about moments of kindness, that Erica had invited me to go out to her house, and she lived in this beautiful sleepy village in Dorset, and and so I drove out there, and it was winter and miserable, and I was losing weight with stress and just completely exhausted, and I arrived at her house and she literally came out and scooped me out of my car and walked me into her house, which was just this beautiful cottage, so warm and homely, and there were two big juicy steaks sizzling on her agar, and she is, you know, sort of very matter of factly. We're eating first, and then we're getting down to business, and you know that again. I suppose there's a theme here, isn't there, of food? But and and that's something that I'm not great at providing for myself at times. So I suppose maybe that's something that people in my life have have observed and feel they need to move in, help me out with. But yeah, and that was her way of showing me love and you know mothering me, I suppose, in her way. And then you know we rolled our sleeves up and we got stuck into everything, and that was a really long day. You know, one of those dark, wintry days where you know there's no sunlight after 3 o'clock, and it just you know. But having her there by my side and guiding me through it, but in a way. Also allowed me to feel confident that I could take it forward, you know, she wasn't doing it for me.

Holly Newson  20:06

Yeah.

Vicki Anstey  20:06

So yeah, and I'll always be grateful for that.

Holly Newson  20:09

And how did it feel when you went in and you realized like she's not only gonna help me take care of the business stuff, but she, you know, she she's thought about this like we're having food first, like I'm, I'm taken care of.

Vicki Anstey  20:22

Yeah, and I think I probably felt a bit apprehensive about going there, and you know, I, I really did for some time carry shame and embarrassment about how could I be 40 years old and I didn't have my own bank account and I didn't know how my business would run itself, but that was my situation, and that's you know how it had transpired for me, and and I think you know particularly in long term relationships, you know you play different roles and you play to your strengths, and you know I thought that that was normal, and you know. also, to some extent, been modeled through my childhood, where you know my dad ran the finances, and that was just how it was done. But you know, ultimately, that got me into a position that wasn't healthy at all, and was very disempowering. So yeah, I felt I felt that shame, and so I think yeah, on that on that drive to Erica's house, I was pretty apprehensive about what she might say about maybe judging me, and I suppose that that moment of walking in and hearing the stakes sizzling on the argo, it was just immediately taken away, and and I realized that there was no judgment there whatsoever. It was just you know nourishment, and then practicality of you know, and then and I left feeling so empowered, um, and and excited,

Holly Newson  22:02

yeah.

Vicki Anstey  22:03

You know, to to kind of see what the next chapter would look like, and yeah, information is power, isn't it? And and realizing also, I suppose, this is a big thing that it wasn't that complicated in the first place. That was huge.

Holly Newson  22:20

Yeah, I think it's a big way that people keep power, isn't it? They they make something seem like I'm the only one that could do it, or you know, or not even I'm the only one, but like we're a select few who understand this, who you know, yeah. So to have have the knowledge yourself and to come away feeling empowered is everything.

Vicki Anstey  22:38

Yeah, absolutely.

Holly Newson  22:43

So, can you tell me a time that someone did something kind for you

Richie  22:46

During COVID, my local church very kindly helped me at a time where I didn't have a job, and instead of collecting money for the church, they collected money for me and my family.

Holly Newson  23:06

That's so amazing! What impact did that have on you and your family?

Richie  23:09

Oh, it was great because I was already down the dumps, my mum was working two two jobs at the time, and it helped me more than I could ask. Well, so it was really good.

Holly Newson  23:21

Amazing! And can I ask what your name is?

Richie  23:23

Richie.

Holly Newson  23:24

Richie, thank you so much. It was so nice to meet you.

Holly Newson  23:26

Your third story of kindness. If you explain the challenge you were setting yourself, like what were you about to go and try and do?

Vicki Anstey  23:43

Yeah, I was about to go and row across the Pacific, the mid-Pacific,

Holly Newson  23:47

just casual, in a boat, little row across the mid-Pacific.

Vicki Anstey  23:52

Yeah, so I realize that entails a bit of a leap forward in time, doesn't it? So maybe I'll go back a little bit because about six months after I left my marriage, I became aware that women were allowed to apply to participate in SAS Who Dares Weeks, a TV program, and it was something that I'd watched kind of casually when only men could do it. Thinking, I quite like the idea of that. Wonder how far I'd get. And after I left the marriage, I realized that I suppose I didn't have to ask for permission from anyone to do anything anymore. And I, I think I was at a point where I just thought, like, fuck it, what do I actually have to lose here? Yeah. And some, to some extent, a bit of necessity, I suppose. I had to like really radically turn my life around and get back on my feet, and and I didn't really know how on earth I was going to do that. But this opportunity presented itself, and I just thought, what the hell? So I. Applied to do that and got through to the final stages. Again, that's a huge leap forward in time, and all the detail of that is in my book. An amazing experience, and you know, highly accelerated, concentrated lesson in you are more capable than you know than you think. And when I came out of that process, I went. I was at a press event for SAS Who Dares Wins,

Holly Newson  25:28

yeah.

Vicki Anstey  25:29

And someone came up to me and said, "Would you want to row an ocean? And again, leap back, I'd grown up with a fear of deep open water, so I'd had a near drowning incident when I was a child, which was, you know, it's sort of buried somewhere right in the back of my memory. I was six years old, so I sort of barely remember the event, but I certainly know that I carried, you know, the fear of that with me through my whole life, and developed all these very clever avoidance strategies to never be in deep water, which you know I had to confront on SAS. Who dares wins? That didn't end terribly well either. So it, you know, I sort of came out of that process very proud of what I'd achieved, but with this overwhelming sense that I had to tackle this fear of water, that it kept, it was hugely unresolved, and you know my responses when I am in deep open water, it was absolute panic state. It's pure fear, yeah, and it's completely irrational because I'm perfectly strong and capable of treading water, and you know all of that. But actually, it's the it's the psychological, mental, emotional part of it that that kind of gets you. And and literally within the second of her asking me what I want to row an ocean, I'm like my brain is like spinning through all this stuff, thinking like, well, this is this is my life now. I do mad things apparently, and. and also, but the water thing's an issue, and I feel like I need to have a really big thing in order to address that. And rowing an ocean, like you couldn't get more confronting in terms of fear exposure than that. And so I literally just said yes, and I didn't know anything about it. I didn't know what an ocean rowing boat looked like, which ocean, how long it would take, anything. Yeah. And so then that started the next kind of chain of events. So long story cut short, I ended up rowing across the Pacific with two other women in 2021, and it took us 60 days.

Holly Newson  27:40

Wow!

Vicki Anstey  27:41

And we got a world record.

Holly Newson  27:42

Congratulations!

Vicki Anstey  27:43

Thank you. And it was wonderful and terrible all at the same time. Very difficult team dynamic. And again, there's a lot of detail behind that, which I won't go into necessarily now. But it's all in the book. They weren't the two women that I had originally intended to do the row with, and it was postponed because of COVID. And I had to then find a new team, and I didn't meet one of them until we got to San Francisco. So, lots of kind of extenuating factors, I suppose. But back to the act of kindness. This one is kind of multiple, I suppose. Before I did the row, and really before I had any idea how it was going to play out, I asked my friends, mostly a couple of few family members, to write me letters to take with me.

Holly Newson  28:34

Yeah,

Vicki Anstey  28:35

I suppose sort of thinking, well, what if something happens to my phone? What if I lose all contact with the outside world. I had no idea how much I would end up needing them.

Holly Newson  28:45

Yeah,

Vicki Anstey  28:46

and I can't even remember where the idea came from. And I ended up taking 70 letters.

Holly Newson  28:53

70?!

Vicki Anstey  28:54

So not from 70 different people, yeah, you know, lots of people wrote me multiple letters.

Holly Newson  28:59

How much of your like supplies was that?

Vicki Anstey  29:03

Well, so we allowed we allowed ourselves one luxury item each, and that was my luxury item. So I had this kind of wad of letters that would were stuffed into the netting inside the cabin, and I would like read one a day, maybe two. I'd sometimes binge on them, sometimes I'd have to ration them. I'd like read them while I was eating food. Usually, so most of them are still stained with with food, and they were my lifeline.

Holly Newson  29:34

Yeah,

Vicki Anstey  29:35

like a secret weapon to get through a very very difficult isolating experience,

Holly Newson  29:44

yeah,

Vicki Anstey  29:44

and reminders from the people who knew me the best that I could do what I'd set out to achieve, but that also I was loved elsewhere.

Holly Newson  29:54

When did you crack into the first one? When were you like, okay?

Vicki Anstey  29:57

Well, so I was, I was horribly seasick for about 20 days.

Holly Newson  30:03

Oof!

Vicki Anstey  30:03

so I, I'm not sure I, I actually could tell you exactly which day, but you know, for a long, for a long chunk of that 20 days, I couldn't function in any way other than to just row. That was the only thing that made me feel better.

Holly Newson  30:16

Yeah.

Vicki Anstey  30:17

So I never missed a single shift due to the seasickness, but as soon as I got in the cabin, I had to like lie down immediately.

Holly Newson  30:25

Yeah,

Vicki Anstey  30:25

it was debilitating. So it might have been yeah a while before I kind of finally got around to starting to read them.

Holly Newson  30:35

Yeah,

Vicki Anstey  30:35

and it's quite amazing what people will write to you.

Holly Newson  30:39

Yeah,

Vicki Anstey  30:39

when I suppose they think they might not see you again, or when they might imagine you in that scenario, you know, on an ocean, in a tiny 24 foot boat being thrown around in storms, and you know, surrounded by sharks, maybe, or

Holly Newson  30:58

yeah,

Vicki Anstey  30:59

you know, and just in a general state of complete physical depletion and sleep deprivation, and and so things that people would tell me about me, but also about themselves,

Holly Newson  31:12

right?

Vicki Anstey  31:13

And stories that I don't think maybe they would have told me otherwise. Things about their lives. I mean, it was just the most wonderful thing, and I obviously still have them. And actually, I've put a few of them in the book as an appendix.

Holly Newson  31:28

Yeah.

Vicki Anstey  31:28

And yeah, they they really kept me going.

Holly Newson  31:34

Yeah. Should we read one?

Vicki Anstey  31:36

Yeah.

Holly Newson  31:36

Should we do that?

Vicki Anstey  31:37

Yeah.

Holly Newson  31:38

I'll hand you the book.

Vicki Anstey  31:39

Okay. Maybe I'll read one from Ali. Ali sent me off with this stash of like postcards, and she had found like quotes that she'd attach, and then she'd just write things from herself. Some of them were handwritten. This one is typed though. It says that the quote is by Hunter S. Thompson: "Never turn your back on fear; it should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed." Quite a lot of her stuff was a bit dark and edgy. And then she writes, "It is so hard to know how you may be feeling as you read your letters, I'm second guessing and trying not to hijack it with my own perceptions of what you will be experiencing. All I know is that you are one incredible, beautiful, and determined human being who has torn up the rule book." Yeah, and you know, just I can't explain what that environment was like, where you can't see, you don't see land for 60 days.

Holly Newson  32:50

How did it feel that these people who've written you the letters have kind of, you know, the pre-imagined you? Yeah, in that situation, like they're writing to like future Vicki. What did what did that feel like to have someone have gone like of literally imagined your future directly?

Vicki Anstey  33:06

Oh, and it meant so much. And and what I would be going through, one of my other friends, she's actually my speaking coach, and she's a clinical psychologist, so she helped me decompress a lot of the events from the row, she really understands me. She she wrote me letters, and I do to her face call her a white witch because she's got this spooky ability to kind of predict things.

Holly Newson  33:33

Yeah,

Vicki Anstey  33:34

and her letters were in sort of a sequential order, depending on like how far into the race we were,

Holly Newson  33:40

yeah,

Vicki Anstey  33:41

and it was freaky how she would write something that related exactly to what was going on at the time. That was just mad to me. So yeah, people imagining, as you say, what I was going through, which is to someone who hasn't done an ocean row, quite unimaginable, really difficult to kind of imagine, and then also like what it what it would be like to have finished, you know. On the other side, you know, when you get back home,

Holly Newson  34:10

yeah,

Vicki Anstey  34:11

we'll do this, and you know, this is how you'll feel maybe, and

Holly Newson  34:15

yeah,

Vicki Anstey  34:16

so powerful. Like that's just love reaching out over an ocean.

Holly Newson  34:21

Do you read them? Do you read them all back now? Did you read them all for the book?

Vicki Anstey  34:25

I did for the book. Yeah, yeah. Oh my god. I mean, that was like one of one of the many reasons why writing the book has just been like so tough, but also so amazing and therapeutic and cathartic, but like peeling layers of skin off at times, going back into you know experiences that were visceral, and you know the reminders of that. So yeah, reading those letters back, I also recorded voice notes for myself, like as a sort of dear. Diary, kind of, and it took me 18 months before I could listen to that back. And yeah, when I did, I think I was on a flight going somewhere. I can't remember where. Long flight. I have like four hours of voice notes recorded, and you can hear all the sound of the boat, and you know, various like beeps going off and the sound of the waves and the wind and chatter and you know, and that took me right back. It was it was yeah almost quite quite difficult to to listen.

Holly Newson  35:33

Yeah, an amazing thing to have documented. But yeah, yeah, I think listening to something sometimes even more than sometimes watching it, you're like you're back there.

Vicki Anstey  35:42

Well, that was really the the very first step into writing my book because we were having a documentary created, which hasn't quite come about yet. But you know, these things do take so so long. It's still sort of in the in the ether somewhere. But the documentary filmmaker that we were working with, I sent him my voice note recordings, and he transcribed them, and he sent them back to me, and he said, "This will be your book." And I honestly, the idea never even occurred to me, and I just thought, I'm not writing it. I'm never going to write a book, and you know, in a way that you know, it's sort of more been about the let so the letters appear at the start of every chapter in the book. There's a little excerpt from each letter.

Holly Newson  36:30

And so, my final question to you: What is the kindest thing that you have ever done for yourself?

Vicki Anstey  36:36

Oh my goodness, I don't think that's my best quality.

Holly Newson  36:42

Oh,

Vicki Anstey  36:44

What's the kindest thing? Oh, okay. Having dogs.

Holly Newson  36:51

Oh, that's a brilliant one.

Vicki Anstey  36:52

Yeah, yeah. Dogs have been a real like constant in my life.

Holly Newson  36:57

Yeah,

Vicki Anstey  37:00

and my book is dedicated to Ebony, who was my flat coat retriever, and she actually died while I was writing the book. I'm sorry. Yeah, they're they're so amazing. I don't know if you have a dog.

Holly Newson  37:22

I have a cat, which I know for a dog person doesn't feel the same. But I know that I know that love of an animal who is just you know they're there for you. They they get you in a way that...

Vicki Anstey  37:36

yeah they really do, and they see things and they hold things. I think for you, I feel like she she was a she was in my life through the really tough times, and yeah. And when I left my marriage, my husband said, "I think we should have the dogs rehomed. Whoa! I I mean that was just a moment for me of like utter determination that come what may, you know, I'd be on the streets with my dogs. I wouldn't care, you know, and so that sort of became, yeah, fuel in a way for me to rebuild my life and make sure I could create a home for them.

Holly Newson  38:16

Yeah.

Vicki Anstey  38:18

So yeah, I feel like she kind of she kept my secret safe.

Holly Newson  38:21

Yeah,

Vicki Anstey  38:22

and and yeah, she sadly passed away while I was finishing writing the book. And I and there is a whole section in the book about dogs, and I wonder. I I do reflect in that section whether maybe she felt like her work was done, or it's funny, isn't it? And I know they're only dogs, but they're they're not. If you're a dog lover or a cat lover,

Holly Newson  38:50

I think

Vicki Anstey  38:50

you get it, don't you?

Holly Newson  38:51

Yeah, yeah. I don't. I never think you know a pet is just a pet.

Vicki Anstey  38:57

So yeah, I guess that's my something that you know kindness that I've given to myself every day, and I have two dogs now. So I got another puppy flat coat about six months after Ebony left, and I have a an Irish setter called Olive, who's just completely silly and so different. They're such different dogs, but it's just yeah the best

Holly Newson  39:22

yeah

Vicki Anstey  39:23

best pair is something to go home to

Holly Newson  39:25

yes

Vicki Anstey  39:26

Always pleased to see you you know but also remind you of how important the the small things are in life the simple joys and just being out in fresh air and you know just sheer happiness from running around and chasing sticks, and you know, so it's a reminder. I think that life can get overwhelming and complicated, and we can spend so much energy living up to I don't know the world's expectations. Expectationsf ourselves, but then also the energy that we spend trying to manage the forecast and other people's kind of weather patterns, and you know, yeah, and and sort of trying to, in some way, protect ourselves or to navigate through all of that, and I hope the book is is kind of a guide for people to realize how to let go of some of that stuff at times,

Holly Newson  40:30

yeah,

Vicki Anstey  40:31

and just kind of focus inwardly,

Holly Newson  40:34

yeah, and on belly rubs and tails wagging,

Vicki Anstey  40:38

yeah, and stroking ears, throwing balls, yeah.

Holly Newson  40:44

Well, Vicky, thank you so so much for coming to chat. It has been such a joy.

Vicki Anstey  40:50

I'm sorry for getting so emotional.

Holly Newson  40:53

Oh no, not at all.

Vicki Anstey  40:53

You've created such a lovely space. Thank you. It's been great to be here.

Music  40:58

Hey, hold on,I'll stay here til it goes

Holly Newson  41:06

Thank you so much for listening. You being here and your support means a lot to me. Vicky is such a beautiful soul to be in the presence of, and I'm so glad she thought of a way in which she's kind to herself because she deserves that internal kindness, and that is clearly something that all her friends can see. Do check out her book, Other People Are Like the Weather. This episode is dedicated to anyone who has seen what you needed and just acted on impulse. Maybe share the episode with one of those people in your life or someone else who might enjoy it. I would also love to hear a story from you about a time someone was kind to you. So send me a voice note at kindpodcast.com, or you can email me holly@kindpodcast.com, and I will feature some of the stories on the show. If you like the show, hit subscribe, hit follow, giving it a rating, a review, all of that stuff helps me so much. It was great to spend time with you. Speak soon.